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KCraised;238243 wrote:Ouch, we are the worst kind of people, OPLookn. That’s pretty harsh, i would say. Hopefully behind serial killers and pedophiles;-)
Well, ill put my list of qbs up against yours anydayPeople who complain about sports contracts almost always turn out to be pedophiles and serial killers.
What list of QBs?
We need to spend that 33 mil to get what we need but we never spend it and we never fully get what we need. We have our list of hopefuls and Well, they have there’s. After watching the Colts game last night, I am worried about next weekend.
OPLookn;238246 wrote:Well when you list off so many needs what would one need to go out and get that? Oh yeah…money!! We’re under the cap but unless you can get those great players you always seem to be listing off or complaining about for far under 30 mil a year I personally give a **** about what Cassel is paid. Talk about short sighted.We have plenty of money. Our owner is pinching pennies. We’re $30M under the cap. If we were paying Cassel $1M a year, we’d be sitting at $40M under the cap. Hell, we cut guys who should have been Chiefs-lifers (like Waters) to save money.
If our owner wanted to field a better team with better players on the lines, he could have. Easily. But he didn’t. Hell, we’re paying out less than $70M in salaries (actual money, not cap) this year (Kansas-City-Chiefs Salaries | Kansas-City-Chiefs Player Salaries | 2011 Kansas-City-Chiefs Salary).
Neither Cassel nor any other Chief has anything to do with it.
Ryfo18;238152 wrote:A bandwagoner is someone who jumps on board only when the team is doing well. Just because someone thinks something negative about someone or something on the team, does not make them a bandwagoner.On the other hand, there are also many homers on this board, those that are ignorant to the fact that the team is nowhere as good as you think they are, and that every player is awesome.
Whether you can be negative about your team or not make no difference, in the end we are all Chiefs’ fans.
I agree 100%.
jmlamerson;238251 wrote:People who complain about sports contracts almost always turn out to be pedophiles and serial killers.What list of QBs?
Man, my life is getting ready to take an ugly turn soon….guess thats what happens to the worst kind of people:-/
My list of qbs…brees, manning, etc? Meaning, in theory, you can grind it out with your average qbs all you want. I’m going to keep your list saved and we will see in week 16, what qbs lead thier respectuve teams to just the playoffs this year.And btw, its just for fun. I’m on this site for a reason. Alot of debating subjects. Provokes some thought, if people keep an open mind. I like what the other side has to say. Otherwise, i would just leave;)
KCraised;238255 wrote:Man, my life is getting ready to take an ugly turn soon….guess thats what happens to the worst kind of people:-/
My list of qbs…brees, manning, etc? Meaning, in theory, you can grind it out with your average qbs all you want. I’m going to keep your list saved and we will see in week 16, what qbs lead thier respectuve teams to just the playoffs this year.Huh? I know guys like Brady and Rogers are better than average QBs. I know that teams are likely to do better with a great QB than an average QB. I know, and posted a dozen times, that Cassel is average. If I could swap him for Rogers or Brady I would.
I also know that having an average QB is something that about a third of NFL teams have to go through. By definition. We got Cassel for a 2nd rounder. We’ve gotten a good return on our investment. It doesn’t mean we shouldn’t upgrade if given the chance, but it doesn’t mean that he’s the cause of this team’s problems either.
What, exactly, are you disagreeing with here?
jmlamerson;238259 wrote:Huh? I know guys like Brady and Rogers are better than average QBs. I know that teams are likely to do better with a great QB than an average QB. I know, and posted a dozen times, that Cassel is average. If I could swap him for Rogers or Brady I would.I also know that having an average QB is something that about a third of NFL teams have to go through. By definition. We got Cassel for a 2nd rounder. We’ve gotten a good return on our investment. It doesn’t mean we shouldn’t upgrade if given the chance, but it doesn’t mean that he’s the cause of this team’s problems either.
What, exactly, are you disagreeing with here?
Well, im saying im not content with an average qb. And, as much as we want playoff games, I want a Superbowl. I’m saying why grind it out with Cassel? You admit he is an average qb. I totally agree. Its has sounded like you’re content with that. I’m not. But now you say if we have a chance to upgrade, we should do that. Alittle confused now but i will say I agree with your last reply 100%. We are officially completely on the same page with your last post.
okikcfan;238252 wrote:We need to spend that 33 mil to get what we need but we never spend it and we never fully get what we need.jmlamerson;238253 wrote:We have plenty of money. Our owner is pinching pennies. We’re $30M under the cap.
…Hell, we’re paying out less than $70M in salaries (actual money, not cap) this year (Kansas-City-Chiefs Salaries | Kansas-City-Chiefs Player Salaries | 2011 Kansas-City-Chiefs Salary).
That link is out of date. Click on it and see how mauch Hali and Flowers are making. You may have trouble finding them because they aren’t even listed! According to Kansas City Chiefs 2011 Team Management | Tradition Sports Online The Chiefs total salary is $107,390,000 and the Cap space is $12,610,000. I posted that info a week ago, but you two obviously didn’t bother to read it because you are still quoting inaccurate figures.
You can look it up here: (click on the little blue box with the arrow in it next to my name.)
TopekaRoy;237276 wrote:I’ve been hearing that the Chiefs have between 30 and 35 million in cap space since the preseason started. That was before we signed Tamba Hali for $12 million per year and before we signed Brandon Flowers to $10 million per year….KCraised;238261 wrote:Well, im saying im not content with an average qb. And, as much as we want playoff games, I want a Superbowl. I’m saying why grind it out with Cassel? You admit he is an average qb. I totally agree. Its has sounded like you’re content with that. I’m not. But now you say if we have a chance to upgrade, we should do that. Alittle confused now but i will say I agree with your last reply 100%. We are officially completely on the same page with your last post.I would love to upgrade Cassel – if possible. All of the teams I referenced earlier with average QBs would love to upgrade their QB situation. The problem is that it’s really, really hard to find a superstar QB. Cassel is a perfectly fine stand-in until we do.
If we pass on a superstar QB to retain Cassel, the problem is with the GM, not with Cassel. Who has done about as well as a reasonable person could have expected given the tools (both coaching and otherwise) he’s been working with.
TopekaRoy;238262 wrote:That link is out of date. Click on it and see how mauch Hali and Flowers are making. You may have trouble finding them because they aren’t even listed! According to Kansas City Chiefs 2011 Team Management | Tradition Sports Online The Chiefs total salary is $107,390,000 and the Cap space is $12,610,000. I posted that info a week ago, but you two obviously didn’t bother to read it because you are still quoting inaccurate figures.You can look it up here: (click on the little blue box with the arrow in it next to my name.)
I did read it. Your link is wrong and with the wrong numbers. Just because some guy posted it on the internet doesn’t make it automatically correct (and yes, irony, blah blah blah).
jmlamerson;238264 wrote:I did read it. Your link is wrong and with the wrong numbers. Just because some guy posted it on the internet doesn’t make it automatically correct (and yes, irony, blah blah blah).So your link is correct even though it doesn’t include Hali’s ($12 million) and Flowers’ ($10 million salaries)? How can that be? How do you know your numbers (sportscity’s numbers) are more accurate than mine?
It even says at the bottom of the page you linked to:
Quote:Some players may not be listedTranslation: “Even we ourselves are not sure if these numbers are accurate.”
I can see at least 2 players who aren’t listed.
jmlamerson;238250 wrote:First, NE wasn’t a “solid passing offense.” It was one of the greatest passing offenses of all time.Opinions of Cassel’s ability should not be put on hold until he has a good-to-great supporting cast and coach. Very, very few QBs in the NFL will ever have those advantages. Hell, very few players will. If you want to wait until they retire to judge a player, that’s your business. But most people want to discuss the team and its players now.
Orton does have below-average arm strength. Kind of like Weis/Cassel, McDaniels was able to work around that. Look at the statistical difference between Orton’s last year and this one. He’s clearly regressing.
My opinion of Cassel isn’t based upon what he might do in the future. My opinion of Cassel is based around what he’s already done. He’s a career 83.0 QBR, 59% completion rate, 24-21 overall record, 0-1 playoff record, and 6.6 YPA. He might turn into Drew Brees, he might go the way of Ryan Leaf. Or he might stay at Brad Johnson-levels of averageness. The smart money is on the third.
I didn’t say you should put your opinion on hold.
I said I find it difficult to pin him down as anything, seeing as how I have seen him do what he is not supposed be able to do.
As for Those Patriots, you can all them “The greatest of all time”, but how do you not consider the loss of Brady as making it far, far less than that?
How many championships have The Chicago Bulls won without Micheal Jordan?
It’s arguable that it was the best ever. But not when you subtract Tom Brady. Then it is rather questionable. And, rather or not anySchmoe could have done what Cassel did is extremely opinion-driven.
Cassel was not just a career backup, but he had even spent his entire collegiate career as a backup. One could easily say that he was more inexperienced than a rookie.
Alright, let’s look at the three year average of the greats….
Tom Brady – 86.6; 85.7; 85.9
Payton Manning – 71.2; 90.7; 94.7
Drew Brees – 76.9; 67.5; 104.8Matt Cassel – 89.4; 69.9, 93.0
You don’t think this looks appropriate for a three year starter?
I mean, Brady started right out with a Super Bowl team, and his average is right on par with Cassel’s first three, and that includes Cassel playing for this team two years.
You can always point to guys like Rivers and Rodgers, who instantly hit the numbers. But I think it is fair to list those guys as exceptional.
But, three of the best of the best QBs in The NFL right now, had average numbers through their firsth thgree seasons.
In fact, it would probably be fair to say that “average” is pretty good for a guy in his first three seasons, no?
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Hey. Keep your opinion if you want.
I just think you are leaving yourself open to being made a fool of, should Cassel continue to improve.
But then, that is the best way to be fooled, is by Chiefs doing better than you thought they could.
TopekaRoy;238266 wrote:So your link is correct even though it doesn’t include Hali’s ($12 million) and Flowers’ ($10 million salaries)? How can that be? How do you know your numbers (sportscity’s numbers) are more accurate than mine?It even says at the bottom of the page you linked to:
Translation: “Even we ourselves are not sure if these numbers are accurate.”I can see at least 2 players who aren’t listed.
Go to the spotrac site referenced in the link. It actually takes you through every contract, although not in as readable of a form: Kansas City Chiefs Player Contracts, Salaries, & Transactions.
You remember that I said actual salaries were below $70M, and specifically said that wasn’t the salary cap number, right? Our salary cap number still gives us $30M to spend, and the random message board post you linked to is incredibly off.
And remember, a cap number just isn’t the total amount of the contract divided by a number. Things like bonuses are prorated (or sometimes not).
jmlamerson;238253 wrote:. Hell, we’re paying out less than $70M in salaries (actual money, not cap) this year (Kansas-City-Chiefs Salaries | Kansas-City-Chiefs Player Salaries | 2011 Kansas-City-Chiefs Salary).That link is from SportCity.com The say the source of their numbers is
Quote:Source: Spotrac.comSpotrac currently lists Flowers salary at $555,000,000 which is no longer accurate and is not included at all in the total you quote. Hali’s Salary isn’t even listed there. So not only is your source wrong, your source’s source is also wrong!:lol:
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